UK
Graduate Programmes
To MSc or not to MSc?
10 May 2007COMMENTS
I don't wanna attend an Italian MSc, since they really suck, but I also don't have enough money to join a UK or American university. That's why I have thought about RSM in Rotterdam, which both Financial Times and Newsweek rate as the 6th best business school in Europe and which only costs about 1500€ (1000£) a year. Read all comments »If you haven't got a graduate training place, but are desperate to work in banking, will an MSc help you get what you want?
YES, if…
You studied a non-finance degree. If you graduated (or will graduate) in English literature or geography, an MSc in a finance-related subject shows you're keen. "It shows your commitment to the industry," says Julia Barbour, a consultant at finance recruitment firm Cornell Partnership. "You'll be on more solid ground when it's finished."
You have no finance-related work experience. Most students from Continental Europe have both an MSc and financial services work experience. The MSc won't do anything about the work experience but it will make you their academic equal.
You apply to the right school. Plenty of universities offer financial services MScs, but banks only hire from a few of them, and then only from favoured courses. The best universities and courses for a finance-related MSc include:
• the MSc in Finance at Imperial College's Tanaka Business School or its more specialist MSc in Risk Management and Financial Engineering
• the MSc in Financial Mathematics at Warwick
• the Masters in Financial Economics at Oxford University's Said Business School
• the MPhil in Finance at Judge Business School in Cambridge
• the MSc in Finance at the London School of Economics
Cass Business School also offers a number of MSc courses, which are viewed quite favourably by banks. And Reading University's ICMA Centre offers a very wide range of specialist programmes, plus its more general flagship MSc in International Securities, Investment and Banking.
You want to go into financial markets (rather than corporate finance). "The increased complexity of financial products means there's likely to be on-going demand for candidates with qualifications like an MSc," says Malcolm Horton, head of European graduate recruitment and development for Lehman Brothers.
You want to work in a hedge fund. As small organisations, hedge funds don't have the training resources of larger banks and are therefore keen on MSc students. "They will only take people with an MSc because they've had the technical training," says Lindsay Bortoluzzi, head of postgraduate employment at Cass Business School in London.
NO, if…
You got a low 2.2 in your first degree. Most big American bulge-bracket banks will discount anyone without a 2.1 degree, even if they have an MSc. However, some European banks will entertain applications from students who have strong A levels and were predicted a 2.1 but didn't quite make it. Unfortunately, they won't go on the record saying who they are. However, a graduate recruiter at one large European bank says, "A 2.1 is not a make or break for us, so an MSc can help. But we are in the minority."
You're innumerate. It's no good doing an MSc if you have the mathematical aptitude of Paris Hilton (who may well be a whiz at stochastic analysis for all we know). But if your maths is that bad you may not get onto an MSc course in the first place.
You want to be a quant. If you fancy being a quant, you're better off going straight into a PhD. Several banks, including JPMorgan and Morgan Stanley, offer specific entry positions for candidates with PhDs in maths, physics or other quantitative disciplines.
You plan to skip the first few years of training and come in at a higher level. You may have forked out many thousands of pounds and studied finance for a whole year, but after doing an MSc most banks will treat you just the same as a graduate with a Bachelor's degree. It's a sad truth, but with banks getting 30 to 40 applications for each analyst they have no need to treat MSc applicants any differently.
You're doing it as a filler and are not sure what you really want to do. "An MSc is a good thing, but what really matters is your motivation and your communication skills," says Lucy Evans, a graduate recruiter at ABN AMRO. "You won't be better equipped if you don't know what you want at the end of the year."
COMMENTS
Marcello, Student, Sun 20 May 07
Hi Giovanni,
I am finishing my MSc in Investment Management at CASS and like you I decided to come here after my undergraduate degree at Bocconi University. I strongly recommend you my course because it will give you a deeper understanding of the finance related arguments together with an international and exciting environment. Moreover, as you said, the network with the major institutions in the City is a great advantage in your future job searching. If you need further info please do not esitate to contact me.
All the best,
Marcello
Eddy, Student, Mon 21 May 07
Hi everyone,
after researching through the different MSc programms, I found the following 2 groups:
Group1: Finance courses
- MSc in Finance
- MSc in Banking and International Finance
- MSc in International Accounting and Finance
- MSc in Investment Management
- MSc in Real Estate Management
Group2: Quantitative analysis courses
- MSc in Quantitative Finance
- MSc in Financial Mathematics
- MSc in Mathematical trading and Finance
My questions are:
1- Is this partition right?
2- Which master goes with which job in investment banking?
Thank you in advance.
Eddy
CS028, Investment Banking / M & A, Tue 22 May 07
I have an offer for the MSc Economic History at LSE and have an internship this summer at a bulge bracket Investment bank. Will doing this degree be useful if I am keen on Corporate Finance/IBD?
Thanks
Matthew Hall, Investment Banking / M & A, Tue 22 May 07
I am planning on studying the Investment Management course starting Sept this year. Reviewing their website there seem to be tons of financial interest groups. Are any of them interesting, informative or useful? Did You join any?
Add your comment »Gareth, Trading, Tue 22 May 07
Hello, I am currently at the ICMA centre (based at the University of Reading) about to complete their ISIB course - I just wanted to mention a few things: Firstly, whilst arguably perceived as less academic than other courses (e.g. Tanaka, Warwick, Said, Judge etc.) the ICMA centre has the distinct advantage of dealing rooms, which facilitate application of knowledge.
Their current sponsorship deal with Reuters (and the ICMA) is undergoing a considerably ambitious expansion plan, with new facilities due to be open in 2008 that will enhance their focus on dealing room experience. Thus, if you are keen to undertake an MSc with a view to a career in sales and trading, I would definitely recommend applying here.
Furthermore, the ICMA's IFID qualification is recognised by the FSA as leading to FSA approval (combined with the SII Level 1). Additionally, if you are interested in risk management, the lectures are led by Prof. Carol Alexander, who is currently the chair of the PRMIA. It is also possible to study for PRMIA exams and the CFA Level 1 with 7city. Hope that helps a little...
Kumar, Capital Markets, Thu 24 May 07
Hello, I am an Engineering grad with about 12 years IT experience. I have got admission from ICMA Reading for Sept 2007. I am looking for Scholarships to fund my study and living expenses. Can you recommend some sources of funding? Cheers, Kumar.
Add your comment »Andy, Graduate, Fri 25 May 07
Hi everyone, I have been accepted to do an MSc Finance at Durham university in 2007. Could anybody please comment on the creditability of this course and what the top investment banks think about it?
Many thanks
Add your comment »Anonymous, Student, Sun 27 May 07
Andy, I assume that is at Durham business school? I used to be at Durham as an undergraduate - the university enjoys a sound reputation amongst the IB's, although few bother to travel from London to do milkround presentations. I'm not sure the business school is sufficiently well established to rank amongst the top as recognised by recruiters, but considering its affiliation to Durham, it would undoubtedly enjoy a certain level of credibility amongst recruiters. The MSc finance course is probably better recognised at places such as LSE, Warwick, UCL (Tanaka) City of London (Cass) etc.
Add your comment »Kenneth, Student, Mon 28 May 07
Hihi...I also received the Cass offer? But I think it is too expensive for me. And I now intend to choose the Bristol for its MSc Economics and Finance? Could anyone tell me whetherI am wise or not?
Add your comment »Giovanni, Student, Mon 28 May 07
To Marcello,
Ciao, scusa se rispondo solo ora.
Come ti posso contattare? Non penso lo si possa fare in privato su questo sito, se vuoi mi puoi dare l'email della Bocconi, o come preferisci tu.
Grazie mille
To all others, I apologize for using a language other than English, but since this website doesn't allow to contact others in private, and since I'm speaking to another Italian from whom I do need some information, I thought it best to address him in our own language.
Cheers everyone
PS: I might be wrong, but I do believe access to dealing rooms, as offered by ICMA and CASS, definitely adds value to the MSc. Hence, it should be well kept into consideration when choosing a university, especially when considering to apply for a front-desk position in the future.
All the best
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